Tuesday, January 4, 2011

Advanced Dungeon Etiquette: Vote Kicking

With the addition of the Dungeon Finder tool came the option to vote kick members of your party. While a majority of the time you won't need to worry about this whether it be you have a good group or just are running with your friends and not PUGing. However if you are just solo queueing you may run into a situation where you might have to vote kick someone. Today I wanted to discuss when it's a good idea to kick your fellow party members and when you really shouldn't. Kicking for no reason isn't cool, and isn't funny. Seriously, don't do it when it's not needed.

Consider this post to be a sequel to my original post on Basic Dungeon Etiquette. 

When To Kick Someone...


 Now we all have to leave the computer once and a while, it's a fact of life. But any longer than ten minutes of being AFK for me is too much. If you have to leave your computer for longer than that don't queue, that's just how I feel. Some stuff happens I understand. There are exceptions. Just ten minutes is wayyy too long. Before you queue you should always expect the dungeon to last at least an hour. That's at least what I do. Don't have an hour of time? Don't do a dungeon. Simple as that!


This is a fairly obvious one. If someone is harassing you because of any reason at all vote kick them asap. I don't care if you are doing 7 DPS that is no reason to textually attack someone. I see things like this all the time. I'd rather have the bad DPS over a jerk.

Also, if you are the person being harassed report it to Blizzard. You'd do us all a favour to get a person like that banned.

Unwillingness to Learn

If someone enters the group and says "I've never done this place before." this does not mean they should be kicked. Take initiative and explain things. Explain fight mechanics, trash pulls, anything that will help your group succeed! (See here for more!)

However, if after explaining whatever needs said and the person still doesn't get it after numerous wipes, then you have reason to kick them. This also goes for anyone who blatantly ignores mechanics and wipes the group due to stubbornness.

For example: I ran a group with a death knight tank from the random dungeon finder (who was clearly a product of the Wrath of the Lich King era) who had neither done the instance before or knew what CC meant. We had a perfect group for CC too (a rogue/mage/hunter). I then took the time to explain what CC meant, marked every trash pull, and explained what was to be done to each mark. Still after spending countless minutes telling the tank that he should only worry about "Skull" and "X" he still continued to purposely break our crowd control because "it wasn't necessary" and "he never used to have to do that". Meanwhile our healer (me) was crying because I would always have to use cool downs on trash pulls to keep our AoE minded tank alive. Needless to say we kicked him by the time we wiped for a third time on trash. We gave him many chances and he failed every one.

That story is a good example of when someone should be kicked for not learning. He was stubborn and didn't want to change how he wanted to do things despite the fact we kept wiping because of it. Oh and did I mention that he blamed me for the wipes?

When You Shouldn't Kick Someone...

When it's Their First Time Doing the/a Dungeon

If it's someones first time doing a dungeon that doesn't mean they're terrible. Take this opportunity to help them. If, as I said above, they don't listen or follow directions, then you can kick them without guilt. Always give people a chance, no matter what.

If You Think Their Gear isn't Good Enough

This is not a good reason. Not having a certain item level doesn't make someone a bad player. Good players with bad item levels can out DPS bad players with good item levels.

They Won An Item You Wanted

I haven't seen this much, but it's happened. This is childish and immature. Guess what?!?! Loot drops again! It's crazy I know, but hey it does! Who cares if you've ran it fifty times straight and you feel like you deserve it more. I know I don't!

The Tank is Pulling Too Slowly

Calmly ask the tank to pick up the pace. Don't just jump to kicking them from the group. Patience is key when it comes to the random dungeon finder.

When You Should Leave a Dungeon Group...

I hate to say it, but sometimes you have to leave a group. I don't condone leaving as you should prepare to do the dungeon before you even queue. But alas some situations call for it. Here are some situations that I have deemed acceptable for you to leave without feeling rude.

If You Need to do an Extended AFK

Politely explain to your group the situation, they might even want to wait for you! Each group is different as is every situation. The worst thing ever is when someone just drops group out of the blue.

When Your Group Really Can't do it

This is tricky to tell. But if wipe after wipe you seem to not be making progress, tell your group you don't think the group can down the boss or what not. Bring up a discussion on how to fix it. If no solution is presented, explain that you will be leaving. There's no sense in beating your head against the wall if your group isn't geared enough to do a dungeon. Some bosses are relentless. There's no shame in bowing out while you've still got gold for repairs.

When You Shouldn't Leave an Instance...

Any other reason! (With few exceptions!)

If you queue for a dungeon, finish it! I don't care if you only needed loot off the first boss or anything. Leaving after a boss didn't drop your loot you wanted is being a selfish jerk. Sure finding a replacement isn't hard anymore with the random dungeon finder, but that doesn't make it okay! Don't be a jerk.

Sure these "rules" for vote kicking are just my opinion, but that doesn't mean a majority of the players don't agree with me. Be nice and be smart, bottom line. Dungeons are a team activity. You work as a team. People seem to forget this.There's nothing worse than queuing with a selfish jerk that abuses vote kicking or leaves early, so don't be that guy! And if you follow my advice, you won't be!


  1. Great Great Great post!

    I haven't had to 'Vote Kick' anybody yet, so no problems their XD

    You really make your posts so informative and THOUGHTFUL!

    Keep them coming!


  2. Great Post Asil! While I agree with most of it I might add that it should be everyone's responsibility to have seen, and completed, a dungeon on regular, before they attempt it on heroic. There is nothing more frustrating than having to explain to a tank (or dps, or heal) EVERY SINGLE MECHANIC of a fight, when there is only a small change from normal.

  3. @Morituri

    Yes I do agree with you on that one about going through the normal run before running a heroic. Then you only have to explain the small differences,


  4. I'm not sure much infuriates me more than "brb/gtg dinner". Maybe I'm just a regimented douchebag, but when I was in the position where I didn't cook my OWN dinner then it usually arrived at the same time each day. If you know 7pm is the time you eat, then DON'T QUEUE.

    I feel guilty sometimes when I'll queue as DPS, wait half hour or so, need a wee, then wait it out until the queue pops, then run off for 30 seconds :D Thought it best I never tell the group, just blame it on loading screen lag heh.

  5. @Jamin - Thanks! Your kind words are always appreciated!

    @Morituri - I agree with you completely about doing a dungeon on normal before queuing for it on heroic. I personally feel like ALL dungeons should be like how they did Magister's Terrace in how you have to do a quest chain that makes you do it on normal before you can unlock heroic. That would make the dungeon finder way better to use.

    Blizzard did just release something saying about how future tweaks to the system will make it so people will have to know what they're doing before they queue. Maybe this means they're alluding to an implementation of a system that enforces a requirement to do it on normal before Heroic. That would personally make me very happy, no doubt.

    @Riorel - Ah yes, the dreaded "gtg dinner" excuse. That excuse is just like, for me, when people do last minute shopping for say Christmas. Christmas always comes at the same time every year, it doesn't change, why are you never prepared shopping-wise? This goes with the whole dinner thing. When growing up or whatever dinner was always at about the same time. People need to think before queuing =(.

    And I'm with ya about the whole feeling guilty thing. I do the exact same thing with the loading screen lag, if I have to AFK I do that lol. It's funny that you say that. =P

  6. I wish this post was required reading for anyone who queues in the dungeon finder.

    Nice job, Asil. I look forward to seeing you at the end of Stonecore. :)

  7. *lol* love this post :)
    I never pug (unless it's maybe a pugged dps and the rest is from the guild).
    No the biggest fan of 5 man instances (well, they are fun the first 2 weeks but then Blizzard listen to all the whiners and nerf them which makes even fishing more fun... btw Fishing needs a boost).